#12黄泉のツガイ
放送 2026-06-20更新 2026-07-07
FLorianGran
lmao this village cannot catch a fucking break
笑 この村、マジで一息つく暇もないじゃん普通くん
Ltfocus
Kinda leaning on the fuck em side when they started talking about how they should have gotten seal sooner, which literally just means go and kill Yuru. They also immediately started talking about just kidnapping someone he loves to force him to die. These villagers are probably not as good as the show is letting on, which would explain the massacre earlier in the show
「封印を早く取るべき」=Yuru殺害だし考察くん
slicer4ever
原文
I dont really understand what the village plan for yuru was. Its not like they were training him about these powers, or who right & left were(and if they wanted him for their own purposes, you'd think he'd be getting brainwashed at least to be super loyal to the village and its plans). Hell for a village so connected and know about daemons, the fact that basically no one can see them also seems weird. The village seemed to be just wholly and utterly unprepared for any sort of attack beyond the barrier to protect them, which is very weird for a group that supposedly wants to use yuru and asa for their own gain.
村がユルをどうする気だったのか全然わからん。力も右と左も教えず洗脳もなし。ツガイに詳しい村なのに見える人ほぼいないし、襲撃対策もなさすぎて変。普通くん
Peerman044
I'm guessing their plan was to have Yuru killed whilst maintaining plausible deniability of no involvement, since the Shaman guy right at the end also spoke of "5 carefully selected bandits" and then bombard him with prophecies etc. and get a tight grip on him once he would have unlocked seal
ユルを始末しつつ「関与してません」って体裁やろ。祈祷師も厳選盗賊5人言うてたし、封印解いたら予言攻めで握る気やな2ちゃん
saga999
And the fake Asa as another leverage to control Yuru.
あと偽Asaも、Yuruを操るための切り札ってわけかwwwwおじ
Thomas_JCG
原文
They don't reveal the secret because what if Yuru doesn't want to resurrect? Perfect brainwashing does not exist, at least not without a daemon. But if Yuru dies suddenly and is offered a chance to return to his family, he would take it. The only way to see daemons is to make a contract with a pair, and with a village isolated like that, there aren't many to go around. Fake Asa and her half were the only other daemon in the village. The fact that they are so dirty poor, that too is why they want the power of the twins, then they will be the most powerful people in the world.
秘密を明かさないのは、もしユルが復活を望まなかったらって話じゃん。完璧な洗脳はツガイなしじゃ無理だし。でも突然死んで家族の元に戻れるって言われたら受けるだろうね。ツガイが見えるには契約が必要で、あの孤立した村じゃ数も限られてる。村は貧しくて、双子の力で最強になりたいんだと思う。普通くん
SilverGeekly
correction, the anime makes it a point to say there's actually a lot of ways to see daemons. some people can see them just by being sleep deprived as we saw with that one gas station/rest stop worker.
訂正!アニメではダイモンを見る方法って実は色々あるって強調してるんだよね!あのガソスタ?休憩所の店員みたいに、寝不足なだけで見えちゃう人もいるってさ!感情くん
Thomas_JCG
It's not like not sleeping makes you automatically see daemons, otherwise 90% of the population would have seen one and it wouldn't be a secret. Being sleep deprived just puts you closer to the mental state that enables you to see them, just like some people are naturally able to see daemons.
「寝不足=自動でツガイが見える」ではないという考察ができる。そうなら大半が見て秘密にならない。寝不足は見える精神状態に近づくだけ。考察くん
TPIronside
> The only way to see daemons is to make a contract with a pair > just like some people are naturally able to see daemons. The way you walked back what you said but made it sound like you were the one correcting him, is crazy 🤣🤣
「ツガイは契約しないと見えない」→「生まれつき見える奴2ちゃん
Thomas_JCG
Because making a contract is the only guaranteed way, the others are up to chance.
契約するのが唯一確実な方法だからな。他は運任せってことだろう。ドライおじ
Ill_Act_1855
The barrier for the village is very strong and really difficult to get through normally, so they probably figured it just didn't make sense to actually keep most the daemon users associated with their side stationed in the village since barring break actually getting in would have been super challenging
村の結界がかなり強くて普通は突破困難だから、味方のツガイ使いを大勢村に置く意味は薄いって判断したんだと思う。普通くん
SapphireSalamander
they had several years after loosing the girl with the key to prepare.
鍵を持つ少女を失ってから、準備する時間は何年もあっただろwwwwおじ
HornedTurtle1212
Did the village even know rhat she had awoken the power of break?
村は、彼女がbreakの力に目覚めたことすら知っておったのでござるか?武士
Devoidoxatom
it just doesn't seem smart to have no one capable inside the village. its literally just the old grandma. do they have no one like tadera acting as a guard inside the village at least. feels like almost every known character from the kagemoris could easily wipe out the whole village
村の中に戦える奴がいないのは賢くないだろ。実質あの婆さんだけだし。せめてtaderaみたいな警備役はいないのか。kagemorisなら村を潰せそうだ。ドライおじ
somersault_dolphin
dont really understand what the village plan for yuru was. Its not like they were training him about these powers Hard to do that when the last twins were like 400 years ago, and even back then seal was absent.
村がyuruに何をさせる気だったのか読めない。前の双子は400年前で、しかも当時は「封」も不在。能力訓練考察くん
maxdragonxiii
the Seal twin could choose to not come back. we dont know how it works fully, is it a choice or is it an preference of Seal to let Yuru choose to resurrect himself?
Sealのツガイは戻らない選択もできるのかも。仕組みはまだ不明だし、Yuruに復活を選ばせてるのかも分からない。普通くん
somersault_dolphin
原文
It's very unlikely that is the case with how that event is being treated. Pretty sure the people back then knew about the context well enough to ruled out that reason. The much more likely cause is something happened with seal. My theory is seal just isn't there for some reason or another. Maybe the Seal user from more than 400 years ago is actually still alive, or maybe there was a secret special twins that was born outside of the village, and that seal twin already died and reclaimed power before the village seal twin died. Like, surely Arakawa has to playbwith the concept of what if there is or was more than one pair of twins.
その線は扱い的に薄い考察くん
Magicbison
These villagers are probably not as good as the show is letting on Didn't the details from the Kagemori's say that Higashi Village was trying to take over the world or something along those lines? Have they ever been painted in a good light outside of Yuru's POV? I don't think so.
この村人たち、描写ほど善人じゃなさそう。Kagemoriの話だとHigashi Villageは世界征服狙いっぽかったよね?Yuru視点以外で良く描かれたことあった?普通くん
Frostbitten_Moose
原文
I'm not sure Yuru's pov does that great a job either. What with his father telling him not to tell anyone else about the bandits and his family running away from the place. I think most of the good will for the place is the neutral pov viewers come in with, and the assumption that the backwater hicks with no tech getting invaded by helicopters, special forces, and crazy girls with supernatural powers just look like the good guys by comparison because in most stories, they would be.
Yuru視点もそこまで機能してないと思う。父の口止めや家族の逃亡を踏まえると、村への好感は「侵略される田舎=善玉」という前提が大きい。考察くん
wtfduud
Obviously the Kagemoris would try to paint them like that.
そりゃKagemorisなら、彼らをそういうふうに見せようとするよね。普通くん
somersault_dolphin
They used to be part of Higashi Village, it's pretty clear they would know what the village core agenda is.
彼らはかつてHigashi Villageに属していたのだ。村の核心たる目的を知っていて当然だろう。中二病
RiceballWarrior
Not to mention that Dera never denied it.
ましてDeraも一度たりと否定しておらぬでござる。武士
Lraund
I mean they're not great people, but also haven't really done anything and can't really fight.
まあ良い人たちではないけど、実際まだ何もしてないし、戦えるわけでもないんだよな…感情くん
Airwrecktion_
I guess constant assassination attempts on Yuru as well as a successful assassination on Asa constitutes as nothing then? And they do have fighters. Most of them are operating outside the barrier and you know... trying to capture and assassinate the twins. Also remember, all this all an attempt to gain power and take over Japan. Every adult in that village is obvious in on the plotting.
Yuruへの暗殺未遂連発とAsa暗殺成功はノーカンなんか?戦力もおるやろ。日本乗っ取り狙いで村の大人全員グルやん。2ちゃん
Lraund
The basic villagers aren't the one sending out assassination attempts and aren't fighters. I'm not talking about the higher ups and actual assassins.
一般の村人は暗殺を差し向けてないし、戦闘員でもない!上層部や本物の暗殺者の話はしてないんだよ!感情くん
Airwrecktion_
They are all aware and in on the plotting. Even the villagers who don't have access to daemons. They were literally talking about how they should've killed Yuru earlier this episode.
全員が企みを知っててグルだよ。ツガイを持ってない村人ですら普通くん
Jacob-C
Downvoting my comment without offering a good explanation just further proves my point. Do you think that shutting down anime-onlys at every turn helps the series you love grow?
説明もせず低評価とか、こっちの言い分証明してるだけじゃん。アニメ勢を毎回潰して、好きな作品が伸びると思ってんの?ギャル
Jacob-C
原文
They have never shown us that they were all in on the plotting... Other than the 'important people', we have only been shown outside village assassins and the small group at the end of this episode discussing Yuru and Asa's powers. The threads for this show are filled to the brim with source readers defending/attacking the factions based on information that hasn't been given, and downvoting people for having theories/opinions that are 'incorrect'. Kinda ruins the whole experience for anime-onlys like myself. Crazy that we should have to avoid what is supposed to be a spoiler-free discussions because source readers can't keep their curse of knowledge bias in check.
作中で全員が陰謀に噛んでた描写なんてないやん…。原作勢が未出情報で叩き合って、考察に低評価。アニメ勢ワイ萎えるわ。2ちゃん
Lraund
They were literally talking about how they should've killed Yuru earlier this episode. Yeah after most of them were slaughtered.
今回の前半で、Yuruは殺しておくべきだったって普通に話してたじゃん。まあ、その後に大半が惨殺されたけど。普通くん
Airwrecktion_
原文
The village's entire shtick is they they want to claim the power of the twins (by killing them and making it look like it wasnt them) and take over Japan. You can't really be here defending that kind of behaviour. Every 'average' villager is in on it. Some might be more ignorant about daemons than others but most know that if they kill the twins and have them claim their power, they can take over the country. Every one of the assassins were 'average' villagers at one point too
村の目的は双子殺して自分らじゃない風にして力奪2ちゃん
Lraund
The village's entire shtick is they they want to claim the power of the twins and take over Japan. So is everyone on the planet dude. Every one of the assassins were 'average' villagers at one point too This is not true, the assassins had outsider boxers.
村の目的って双子の力を手に入れて日本を支配することだろ。世界中みんなそうじゃん。暗殺者は元村人?いや、外部の普通くん
Airwrecktion_
原文
They had outsider boxers because they were villagers sent away from the village down to mountain to 'work'. Villagers literally live and operate outside in the modern world, Tadera and Hana being an obvious example. The assassins who killed Asa even mentioned seeing her in her cage once back when they use to live in the village. You might need to go do a rewatch or comprehend these details a bit better cause theres no way you forgot such an important plot point?? The Kagemori's believe that the twins power are too dangerous to be used and preferred the twin cycle end so obviously not everyones trying to take over the world.
彼らが外の世界に精通していたのは、村を追われ山で「働く」よう仕向けられた民だからなのだ。TaderaやHanaがその証。刺客もAsaを檻の中で見たと語っていたであろう? 重要な伏線を忘れるとは…再び見返すがよい。KagemoriはツガイのForceを危険と見なし、その血脈の終焉を望んだ。世界征服を企む者ばかりではないのだ。中二病
Standard-Pop6801
Do we actually know if the villagers where the ones who attacked Asa? Kagamori says they did. But I don't remember there being any definitive proof.
Asaを襲ったのって本当に村人たちで確定してたっけ?Kagamoriはそう言ってたけど、決定的な証拠はなかった気がする。普通くん
Airwrecktion_
One of the villagers that kidnapped and killed her said the one they got was definitely Asa because she recognised her from when she was in the village. Only Higashi villager's have the knowledge to find their way in and out of the barrier, Kagemoris needed Asa to break the barrier to get in. So yes, they were definitely Higashi village assassins.
攫って殺した村人が「村で見たからAsaで確定」と言ってた。結界を出入りできるのはHigashi村民だけ。つまり刺客はHigashi村という考察ができる。考察くん
y-c-c
I think it was kind of implied that that villager was rogue in that dialogue. They were trying to capture Asa for their own reasons.
あの会話だと、その村人は単独行動してたっぽいよね。自分たちの目的でAsaを捕まえようとしてた感じ。普通くん
Standard-Pop6801
Ok. Just needed to be sure.
おけ!ちょっと確認しときたかっただけ〜ギャル
saga999
In addition to what the other person said, Asa and her parents "escaped" the village. They even had to leave Yuru behind because they couldn't get him. You don't leave you kid behind to escape a place you can freely leave.
他の人も言ってるけど、Asaと両親は村から「逃げた」んだよ。自由に出られる場所なら、Yuruを置いていかないでしょ。普通くん
RobrechtvE
原文
I'm solidly on team fuck em. Not just because they're all in on the plot to kill and then, provided he didn't perma-die, control Yuru. And given that Shaman, a dude who seems to know more about the supernatural than the average villager, said he thought the whole Break and Seal thing was just an old wives tale... That means the entire adult population of the village aside from the twins' parents and Dera's dad were completely on board with killing two kids on the off chance that maybe the possibility they'd come back to life with cool superpowers was actually true. So yeah, they're all solidly in the 'find out' phase of a multi-generational FAFO situation deserve whatever they get.
俺は完全に「村人ざまぁ」派だな。ユルを殺して、死に切らなければ操るって計画に全員乗ってたわけで。しかもシャマン、超常現象に詳しそうな奴が「ブレイクとシールなんて迷信」と思ってたって点を踏まえると…双子の両親とデラの父親以外の大人全員が、超能力で蘇るかもって薄い可能性のために子供二人殺す気だったってこと。世代越えたFAFOの「思い知る」段階に入ってるって考察ができる。自業自得だよ。考察くん
phoenixking99999999
Dude ikr, the setup for him coming out of the stomach was pretty well done too,.
それなw 腹から出てくる展開の仕込みもガチで良かったやん2ちゃん
yahalloh
That reminds me of [Fullmetal Alchemist: Brotherhood] Gluttony , right?
これ、[Fullmetal Alchemist: Brotherhood]のGluttonyを思い出すよね?普通くん
Beautiful-Bit3929
[Fullmetal Alchemist: Brotherhood] when gluttony being a failed attempt at making an artificial gate was revealed and he ate ed, ling and envy?
[Fullmetal Alchemist: Brotherhood] gluttonyが人工の門の失敗作って判明して、ed、ling、envy食った時!?無理すぎ…感情くん
Animegamingnerd
Funny enough, his character design reminded me so much of Kimbly that I didn't even realize that.
草、キャラデザがKimbly感強すぎて、逆にそれ気づかんかったわ2ちゃん
wtfduud
He reminded me more of [JJBA] Bucciarati
むしろ[JJBA] Bucciaratiを思い出したな普通くん
kazuyaminegishi
Isn't it more like the chimera that were Greed's subordinates? Specifically the sewer sequence where they fight Wrath.
むしろGreedの部下だったキメラっぽくない?特に下水道でWrathと戦うシーン!感情くん
Eunuchest
Homies hate higashi village
うちら東村ガチで嫌いなんだけど笑ギャル
HungryGull
Maybe they should have set their fake historical village up so they'd have protector gods on their person. The kind that send out 9mm 'prayers'.
偽の歴史村を作るなら、身につける守り神も用意しとくべきだったな。9mmの“祈り”を飛ばすやつ。普通くん
inika41
TBF, the shaman and the adults preceded the karmic backlash by lamenting how they couldn’t kill one specific boy on 5 separate occasions out of need for a power struggle
正直、因果応報の前にシャーマンと大人たち、権力争いで特定の少年を5回も殺せなかったって嘆いてたじゃん笑ギャル
BeeLegitimate4968
rhey keep killing them
どんどん殺してくるの無理すぎる…しんどい…感情くん
Niwaka_Samurai
I feel bad for the kids but most of the adults deserve it.
子供らはかわいそうやけど、大人の大半は自業自得やろ。2ちゃん
MrSchmellow
I remember someone in the early threads was wondering how village handles modern diseases. Well, author did consider that small detail.
序盤スレで村が現代の病気どうしてんの?って言ってた人いたよね。てか作者、そこちゃんと考えてたじゃん!ギャル
matdragon
原文
honestly one of the best things about this show is that every detail is almost explained. I love that the show takes its time to show that there is a logic and reasoning happening, not with just their characters, but also the world building Hell everything to do with explaining modern tech to Left and Right and their interpretations of things like AC (wind god). So much attention to detail and i live for it
正直この作品、細部ほぼ全部に説明あるの最高や。世界観も理屈通ってるし、Left and RightのAC=風神解釈とか丁寧すぎて好きンゴ2ちゃん
Zlaynoe
thats why so many people calling this show "too slow" infuriate me
だからこの作品を「遅すぎる」って言ってる人が多いの、めっちゃイライラするんだよ。普通くん
matdragon
Yeah it's wild considering Every episode we learn a bunch of new things and the plot legitimately moves forward every episode Like the MC comes down from the mountain in episode 2 and immediately hunts/looks for his sister and finds them immediately So much has happened every episode it's kind of insane
せやな、毎話新情報ドバドバで話もちゃんと進むのヤバい。2話で主人公が山降りて即妹探して、すぐ見つけるし展開多すぎて草2ちゃん
Dadscope
原文
I don't think the pacing itself is too slow because things are happening and the plot is moving, but the explanation of the world has been dramatically slow for the bulk of the season. There's still the gigantic gaping hole of why this supposed demon-clan village is frozen in time and the bulk of the citizens hold virtually no information of the outside world or demon awareness. It's genuinely dumb to be Higashi Village and not have your people trained around the existence of guns or that there is a huge ever present threat of the Kagemori's trying to get into the village. They didn't even have a mechanism for inspecting outsiders to clear them of a potential threat like the Kagemori's do with Whisper and Embrace.
展開は動いてるから遅くないけど、世界観説明が遅すぎ。Higashi Villageが時間止まってる理由も謎普通くん
HornedTurtle1212
Ignorance is a way to control the villagers. The less they know about the outside world, the less likely they are to want to leave.
無知は村人をコントロールする手段やな。外の世界を知らんほど、出て行きたいって思いにくくなるんや。2ちゃん
Dadscope
For what reason though? How does having a bunch of peasant farmers help you compete with the outside world?
でも何のために?農民を大勢抱えてることが、外の世界と競争するのにどう役立つんだ?普通くん
DameSayo
they are needed for breeding twins. And for work. In order for village to be self-sufficient. Etc. and most of them are assasins. "bandits".
双子を産ませるのに必要ってことじゃん。労働力にもなるし、村が自給自足するためとか。てか大半は暗殺者、「山賊」なんだけど。ギャル
paradoxaxe
to be fair slow can be means some just really want to see action or fight as much as possible personally I found this one quite well paced tho
まあ「遅い」って、単にアクションや戦闘をもっと見たいって意味の場合もあるよね。個人的には今回はテンポ良かったと思う。普通くん
maxdragonxiii
I think this pace is fine and what i sorely missed about since FMA where they do take time to consider other possibilities.
このペース全然アリじゃん!FMA以来恋しかった、他の可能性もちゃんと考える感じがまじ良いんだけど!ギャル
CultistLemming
I'm really tired of modern shonen that have constant fights. I don't care about the characters if I don't get the time to like them during downtime. It makes the fights matter more and haves something at stake.
最近のバトル続きの少年漫画、ガチで疲れるわ。日常回でキャラ好きになる時間ないと、戦いの重みも賭けるもんも薄いんよ。2ちゃん
ByteMeeeee
IMO, maybe they just want action all the time. The plot pacing and world-building of this show are perfect. Unlike Gachiakuta, which has such a slow pace that I couldn't stand it and dropped the show. Maybe it’s just a difference in taste.
個人的な考察だが、常にアクションを求めてるだけかも。この作品の展開速度と世界観構築は完璧。Gachiakutaは遅すぎて切った。好みの差だな。考察くん
rat_infestation
A minor detail is that they do acknowledge like. Supernatural sightings by ordinary folk as well, as a nod to the original folklore and stuff, but keep it just fantastical enough that no one would buy it. Explains how this world could coexist with the regular one, because very few people see it and they think they're hallucinating or something
確かに、一般人の超常現象目撃にも触れてるんだよね。元の民話へのオマージュとして、でも誰も信じない程度にファンタジーに留めてる。これで普通の世界と共存できる仕組みになってて、見た人も幻覚だと思うってのが上手いな。普通くん
Demhandlebars
Wouldn't expect anything less from the mind behind FMA.
さすが鋼の錬金術師の作者だわッ!期待を裏切らないクオリティすぎる!!感情くん
Zekka_Space_Karate
Wow, that's Arakawa for you, a lot of her works have excellent world building.
やばっ!やっぱ荒川先生だよね〜、彼女の作品って世界観作りがまじで神じゃん!ギャル
CrowApprehensive8816
Same with witch hat, love when shows take time with world building
確かに。魔女の帽子もそうだけど、世界観の構築に時間かけてくれるの好きだわ普通くん
Kronman590
I like the small details being addressed but....the biggest one being how we as viewers should feel ok with so many innocent villagers being massacred is still unaddressed. Like even now we know a lot of them cant even see daemons, so what possible threat could they cause? Just...wack
細かい設定に触れてくれるのはいいんだけど…最大の問題は、無実の村人が大量に虐殺されたことを視聴者がどう受け入れるべきか、って点がまだ解決されてないんだよな。今だって、彼らの大半はデーモンすら見えないんだぜ? いったいどんな脅威になり得るっていうんだ…正直、これは納得いかないな。考察くん
Zero3020
原文
A great episode full of new plot development to end this cour. So Asuma is reporting to his uncle who is working with Sword Mustang but Asuma does not seem very interested in actually cooperating with him. I was surprised to see Asuma sharing information with Jin, my read was that they are not cooperating with each other based on previous episodes but things seem to be more complicated. It's pretty much confirmed after this episode that the gate was made using Katana-guy's daemons, and he can also use them to pull a Sticky Fingers and hide inside another person's body. Higashi village just can't catch a break huh, they're still mourning the previous attack and another one seems to be taking place already.
今クールの締めくくりにふさわしい、新展開がたくさん詰まったいい話だったね。アスマはソード・マスタングと協力してる叔父に報告してるけど、実際にはあんまり協力に乗り気じゃなさそうだった。アスマがジンと情報を共有してるのには驚いたよ。前の話からすると二人は協力関係じゃないと思ってたんだけど、結構複雑みたいだね。今回の話でほぼ確定したのは、門はカタナ使いの悪魔を使って作られたってことと、彼がスティッキーフィンガーズみたいに人の体内に隠れる能力を使えるってことだね。東の村も休む暇ないな、前の襲撃をまだ悼んでるのに、もう次の襲撃が起きそうだし。普通くん
CosmicDestructor
Asuma also probably wasn't behind the attack on the Kagemori mansion, considering that he knew nothing about Katana guy.
あの刀の男のこと何も知らなかったって考えると、アスマもカゲモリ邸襲撃の黒幕じゃなかったっぽいな…ってマジで?!情報なさすぎィ!感情くん
MokonaModokiES
seems Asuma is just a guy stuck between two sides and has no other choice but to play double agent to save his own ass.
アスマはどっちつかずの立場にいるって感じだな。自分の身を守るために二重スパイをやるしかなかったんだろうね。普通くん
MonaganX
From what are we inferring that Asuma doesn't know anything about Katana guy? Unless I missed something all his uncle said is that he didn't tell Asuma that katana guy was at his place.
確かに!アスマが刀の男のことを何も知らないってどこから推測してるんだろう?見逃してたかもしれないけど、彼の叔父が言ったのは「刀の男が自分のところにいるってアスマに言わなかった」ってだけだよね。ちょっと気になる〜!感情くん
caiusto
I guess it's about Asuma being seemingly unaware that Katana guy was staying at his uncle's room, so much so that he left one of his moths behind just to be instantly disposed of. But he should know of him by now, considering how his daemon informed him of what was going on inside Tadera's secret house.
多分アスマは刀の男が叔父の部屋にいるのを知らなかったんだろうな。だから蛾を残してすぐに片付けられたんだと思う。でも悪魔からタデラの秘密の家の中の様子を聞いてるなら、もう彼のことは知ってるはずなんだけどね。普通くん
MonaganX
The reason he left the moth behind in the first place might very well be that he already suspected Katana guy was there. But either way, it's a big leap to go from him not knowing where Katana guy was to him not knowing of katana guy or his involvement in the attack.
彼が最初にあの蛾を残した理由は、おそらくカタナ男がそこにいることを既に疑っていたからだと思われる。だが、どちらにせよ、彼がカタナ男の居場所を知らなかったことから、カタナ男そのものや襲撃への関与を知らなかったと飛躍するのは早計だという考察ができる。考察くん
Blacklegzubair
The uncle said Katana guy could meet Asuma some other time, suggesting they haven't met before
おじさんが刀の男はアスマとまた別の機会に会えるって言ってたから、まだ会ったことないんだろうね普通くん
MonaganX
That doesn't line up with my subs. Do you know what the original Japanese phrasing is?
え、それ私の字幕と合わなくない!?てか元の日本語の言い回しってどんな感じなの?気になるんだけど!ギャル
bedsheetsniffer
>Sword Mustang He reminds me of Kimblee for some reason
>Sword Mustang
なんかキンブリー思い出すンゴwww2ちゃん
LeloThePGG
His design and mannerism resemble a bit of Kimblee I'd say, but he's voiced by the same voice actor as Mustang. So "Sword Mustang" ends up being a pretty funny nickname lol
え、確かにデザインとか雰囲気ちょっとキンブリーっぽくない?笑 でも声優がムスタングと同じってやばくね!?てか「ソード・ムスタング」ってあだ名まじウケるんだけどwwギャル
DameSayo
He also has the same body build as King BRadley and his face does look like Kimblee x Ling Yao. He also has that eastern factor with his katana's. So, he is like chimera. Roy Mustang X Solf J.Kimblee x Ling Yao x King Bradley into one !
彼の体格はキング・ブラッドレイそのものだし、顔はキンブリー×リン・ヤオって感じだね。刀を持ってるから東洋の要素もあるし。つまりキメラみたいな存在で、ロイ・マスタング×キンブリー×リン・ヤオ×キング・ブラッドレイを一人にまとめた感じ!普通くん
bedsheetsniffer
>chimera Please refrain from using that word, I’m still recovering from trauma…
キメラって言葉使うのやめてくれや…ワイまだトラウマから立ち直れとらんねん…2ちゃん
wtfduud
Oh, I just got the pun.
あっ、今気づいたんだけどそれダジャレだったの!?やばくね笑ギャル
mucklaenthusiast
原文
It's kinda crazy how the people from this village just get randomly murdered all the time Like...wow...and was there ever any reason? Clearly the politics are beyond these civilians, even if they are also shady, I guess. But they rightfully fear for their lives. So Asuma is reporting to his uncle who is working with Sword Mustang but Asuma does not seem very interested in actually cooperating with him. I was surprised to see Asuma sharing information with Jin, my read was that they are not cooperating with each other based on previous episodes but things seem to be more complicated. Asuma seems to have his own agenda. And he clearly was disinterested in killing his brother (though maybe that was a lie). So for now, in the Kagemori family, the uncle is one party, Asuma is one party and then there is the main branch. So three factions. I think Asuma probably has selfish reasons for doing what he does, but he doesn't want to be in the same position his uncle is in. Especially because his uncle lacks access to Daemons, which is obviously quite important.
この村の人たち、普通にランダムに殺されすぎでしょ…理由とかあるんか?政治の事情は平民には理解できないんだろうけど、たとえ彼らが怪しくても命の危険を感じるのは当然だよね。アスマは叔父(ソード・マスタングと協力してるやつ)に報告してるけど、あんまり協力する気なさそう。前の話からするとアスマとジンは協力関係じゃないと思ってたから、情報共有してるのには驚いた。でももっと複雑そうだね。アスマには自分の目的がありそうだし、弟を殺す気もなさげだった(嘘かもだけど)。つまり現状、影森家は叔父派、アスマ派、本家の3つに分かれてる感じ。アスマは自分なりの理由で動いてるんだろうけど、叔父みたいにはなりたくないんだと思う。特に叔父はデーモンにアクセスできないからね。普通くん
BakedSalami
Yeah that was our first clear cut response to wether or not the villagers were just innocent bystanders or complicit in all this bullshit.
確かにそれな!!村人たちがただの無実の傍観者なのか、それともこのクソみたいな状況に加担してたのか、初めてハッキリした答えが出たよな…しんどすぎるッ感情くん
mucklaenthusiast
I don’t see it as cleanly. They can be involved and still be more or less civilians. They also don’t have that much power over the village. And they get constantly murdered. Obviously they have a different perspective.
この見解には完全には同意できないな。彼らが関与しているとしても、ある程度は民間人の域を出ないと思う。村に対する権力も限られているし、常に殺害の対象になっている。そういう立場を踏まえると、当然異なる視点を持つという考察ができる。考察くん
mucklaenthusiast
I didn’t mean that part, I meant the politics of the Kagemori and Tadera family and whatever is happening with the parents and their former grandparents and all that stuff. I get that they are involved in the village, but the real world is larger.
そういう意味じゃなかったんだよね。影森家と寺田家の政治的な話とか、両親や元祖父母の関係とか、そういう部分の話。村に関わってるのは分かるけど、現実世界の方がもっと広いしね。普通くん
Jacob-C
It's just a small group that the shaman chose to speak to about this stuff. It certainly proves that there are more villagers that know about it. However, it doesn't prove that everyone knows or what they have been indoctrinated to believe that they need seal and break for.
シャーマンが選んだ一部の村人だけに話したってことは、確かに「知ってる者が他にもいる」って証明にはなるよな。だが、全員が把握してるかどうか、あるいは封印と破壊が必要だとどんな洗脳を受けてきたかまでは立証できてない。この描写からすると、情報の伝達範囲に意図的な制限がかかってる可能性が高い。考察くん
Shimmering-Sky
原文
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ごめん、コメントは削除したよ。未アニメ化の原作ネタバレを含んでるから、ソースマテリアルコーナーで適切にタグ付けして書いてね。フォーマットは:[ネタバレ元] >!ネタバレ内容!< これで。違反したら最低8日間の停止処分。質問あればこのメッセージに返信かmodmail、メタスレッドで聞いて。ルールはここで確認して。普通くん
nqtoan1994
原文
There is one thing. Asuma's uncle is called "Shingo-sama" by the receptionist, so his family name is likely Shingo. He also said that Asuma's mother was useless, which makes it seemed like he was the brother of Asuma's mother than of his father. Perhaps Asuma was a child born from a political marriage between Kagemori family and Shingo family. His mother was supposed to be the mole but for some reason she could not do the job (hence his uncle called his mother useless), and now Asuma is the mole of Shingo family inside Kagemori family.
あ、ひとつ気付いたンゴ。アスマの叔父貴、受付嬢に「シンゴ様」って呼ばれてたから名字はシンゴ家なんやろな。しかもアスマの母ちゃんのこと「役立たず」って言ってたし、父方じゃなくて母方の兄貴っぽいわ。つまりアスマはカゲモリ家とシンゴ家の政略結婚で生まれた子で、母ちゃんがシンゴ家のスパイ役やったけど何らかの理由でできんかった(から叔父に役立たず呼ばわり)、今度はアスマがカゲモリ家に潜り込んだシンゴ家のスパイってことか。草。2ちゃん
mucklaenthusiast
That makes sense. But Asuma still seems…hm, like he has his own agenda
確かに。でもアスマはまだなんか…自分なりの目的がありそうだよね普通くん
Thomas_JCG
Clearly the politics are beyond these civilians, even if they are also shady, I guess. But they rightfully fear for their lives. The villagers were openly talking about how they should have claimed Seal to fight the Kagemori, they are all in the main conflict.
政治とかそういうのは一般市民にはわからんやろな。連中も怪しいっちゃ怪しいけど、命の心配するのは当然やわ。村人らが「カゲモリと戦うならシールを名乗り出るべきだった」って公然と話してたし、全員が本筋に関わっとるンゴwww2ちゃん
Ikari_21
原文
Yeah I’ve been holding off on judging the village just cause we didn’t have full info. But now that we have concrete evidence of them talking about acquiring seal (meaning Yuru has to die) and sending 5 “bandits”, and the fact they too couldn’t see daemons, I can now safely say the adults in that village are collectively twisted. Even the shaman was sus. This time when they all died i didn’t care lol
確かに村の評価は情報不足で保留してたんだが、今回"封印を獲得する=ユルを殺す必要がある"という具体的な証拠が出て、5人の"盗賊"を送った事実、さらに彼らもデーモンが見えなかった点を踏まえると、あの村の大人たちは総じて歪んでいたと断言できる。シャーマンも怪しかったな。今回彼らが全滅しても全く気にならなかったわ。考察くん
mucklaenthusiast
原文
Yes, this is what I said. They rightfully fear for their lives. Remember that the show started with a modern military in a helicopter murdering villagers. So obviously it’s absolutely rational that they want to have break or seal. Twice already random people came to their village and just started murdering. And I also said that they were a bit shady. Like, I don’t know, if you want to reply to a comment, please read it. I totally agree that the villagers aren’t innocent - which is why I didn’t say they were innocent. Still, this far above their level, I mean, they don’t even know about or see daemons
そう、俺もそう言ってるんだよ。彼らが命の危険を感じるのは当然だろ。この作品の冒頭で、現代の軍隊がヘリで村人を虐殺してたのを思い出してほしい。だから彼らがブレイクやシールを欲しがるのは完全に合理的だし。実際、よそ者が二度も村に来て殺戮を始めてるんだぜ。あと、彼らがちょっと怪しいってのも俺は言ったんだよ。いやさ、コメントに返信したいならちゃんと読んでくれよって話。村人たちが無実じゃないってのは俺も同意する——だから無実だなんて一言も言ってないし。でも、これは彼らの理解を超えたレベルの話で、要は彼らはデーモンの存在すら知らないし見えないんだよ。普通くん
nqtoan1994
A bandit was sent to kill Yuru when he was a child, and that event forced Yuru's parents to run away from the village. Then the escaped sister returned with former villagers to destroy the village and save her brother. And she had the power to break the barrier because the extremist villagers killed her once. The first time the village got raided was not by random people at all.
草、全部繋がっとるやんけ!
幼いユルの暗殺未遂→村追放→姉が村人連れて復讐→実は姉は一回殺されてたから結界破れるってガチで伏線回収エグすぎるやろwww
最初の襲撃も適当な盗賊じゃなかったンゴねぇ…2ちゃん
mucklaenthusiast
I am not saying it's random, but I am saying there cleary is a culture of violence here. What did they say in House of the Dragon? Violence begets violence or something? That's what I mean. Since everybody is very happily killing everybody, everybody is rightfully paranoid!
暴力がランダムってわけじゃないけど、明らかにここの世界には暴力の文化があると思うんだよね。『ハウス・オブ・ザ・ドラゴン』で何て言ってたっけ?暴力は暴力を生む、みたいな?まさにそれ。みんなが平気で殺し合ってるから、誰もが当然のように疑心暗鬼になってるんだよな。普通くん
Jacob-C
原文
Exactly. The villagers could very well have been indoctrinated to believe that Yuru and Asa being killed is a small sacrifice to protect the village from the evils outside, or something along those lines. Besides, I still don't think the small group that the shaman chose to speak to proves that every adult in the village knows. Even if they know, we don't know what their reasoning is, we only know the reasoning that the Kagemori clan gave Yuru.
せやな。村人らは「ユルとアサを殺すのは村を守るための小さな犠牲」って洗脳されてる可能性あるやろ。そもそも巫女が話した一部の大人だけで村人全員が知ってるとは限らんし、仮に知っててもカゲモリ一族がユルに言った理屈が全てとは限らんしな。2ちゃん
Zealroth
It's kinda crazy how the people from this village just get randomly murdered all the time Like...wow...and was there ever any reason? What I find crazy is that so far it seems like almost all the villagers are just nobody peasants who are at the mercy of their barrier protecting them. They seem way too lax, even if the barrier is hard to circumvent.
この村の人たち、頻繁にランダムに殺されまくってるのヤバくない?しかも理由あんの?今のところ村民のほとんどはただの農民で、結界に守られてるだけって感じだよな。結界が突破されにくいとしても、ちょっと油断しすぎじゃね。普通くん
pornomancer90
原文
It just seems like the isolation weakened them. The granny seems to be the ringleader of the Higashi's, but she also, as far as we know, doesn't have a clue about the outside world or at most a very limited understanding. That whole setup on the mountain and lack of access to daemons, seems like it's a strategy born out of desperation and a lack of resources and not some kind of genius 4D chess move. The strategy seems to be Step 1: go full Amish Step 2: gain the power of seal and break Step 3: ... Step 4: world domination
この東の一族の戦略、よく分析すると孤立が彼らを弱体化させているように思えるんだよな。婆さんは首謀者的立場だが、外界の知識が著しく不足している。山に籠もって悪魔へのアクセスを断つ戦術は、天才的な4次元チェスではなく、明らかに desperation(絶望的状況)とリソース不足から生まれた苦肉の策だ。つまり、第一段階:完全アーミッシュ化、第二段階:封印と解除の力を得る、第三段階:…、第四段階:世界征服、という稚拙な計画でしかない。考察くん
GaimeGuy
There has to be something else about break and seal (or the twins) that we haven't learned yet.
絶対まだ知らない何かあるって!ブレイクとシール(ていうか双子)の秘密が隠されてるんじゃね?やばくね!?ギャル
Desperate_Method4020
Why? They are clearly in on the whole , using the twins as tools, and killing them, and using Yuru as a weapon against the Kagemoris.
なぜなんだろうね。あいつら明らかにツガイ計画に一枚噛んでて、双子を道具扱いして殺したり、ユルをカゲモリたちに対する武器として利用してるじゃん。普通くん
mucklaenthusiast
Who?
誰だよッ!?感情くん
ShinJiwon
Higashi village just can't catch a break huh, they're still mourning the previous attack and another one seems to be taking place already. Tbh those adults totally deserved it. I just feel bad for the children.
東の村は本当に休む暇がないね。前の襲撃の悲しみも癒えてないのに、もう次の事件が起きてる。正直あの大人たちは自業自得だと思う。でも子供たちは本当に気の毒だな。普通くん
HalfAssedSetting
I just hope we get to see someone more capable on their side. At this point they haven’t put up much of a fight. I’m surprised the village even lasted this long.
マジで敵側にもっと有能なやつ出てきてほしいじゃん!?今んとこ全然戦いになってなくない?てかこの村よくここまで持ったなって思うんだけど笑ギャル