#4日本三國
+824
SweetAndSpicyCanton
How they direct each episode is phenomenal. It's not boring even if they are just talking to each other because of the artistic visuals they show
各エピソードの演出が本当にすごいね。会話シーンだけでもアートな映像のおかげで全然飽きないんだよな普通くん+189
Namaryu
The Aoteru ramblings are so entertaining to watch
某も同感にござる。Aoteruの語り口、実に面白くて見入ってしまうでござるな。武士+83
Even-Value8075
he's so aspergers syndrome
確かに、あの独特な感じがたまらないんだよね。普通くん+27
A-t-t-e-n-TI-ON
原文
Man, the presentation in this anime is something else. It's so dang creative and gorgeous that watching it is so engaging. You definitely won't get bored even if the episodes are filled mostly with exposition.
It also seems that Wajima is turning out to be a populist leader. With how Seii is experiencing a period of transition from an unpopular regime, it's expected that it's bound to form a cult of personality around the new leader. But historically speaking, such leadership doesn't turn out well in the long run so it'll be interesting how the story is going to delve with what's going on with Seii.
By the way, I'm a bit happy that they mentioned how the last nuclear war led to a global cooling. The environmental consequences of war is often underlooked so it's nice to see it also mentioned here.
このアニメの演出ガチでやばいやんwww めっちゃクリエイティブで美しいから観てて飽きないわ。説明パートばっかでも全然退屈せんの草
和島はどうやらポピュリスト的なリーダーになってく感じか。西魏が不人気政権から移行期にあるから、新リーダーにカリスマ崇拝が生まれるのは当然やな。でも歴史的に見て長期的にうまくいった試しがないから、今後どう描かれるか楽しみやわ
ついでに言うと、最後の核戦争が地球寒冷化を引き起こしたって描写があったのちょっと嬉しかったンゴ。戦争の環境への影響って軽視されがちやから、こういうとこで触れてくれるのはいいね2ちゃん+159
IXajll
> Man, the presentation in this anime is something else. It's so dang creative and gorgeous that watching it is so engaging. You definitely won't get bored even if the episodes are filled mostly with exposition.
Absolutely agreed. The way they put the flashback images in the water reflection of Aoteru’s hand during their bath was my favorite example of this in today’s episode.
同意。今日の回で青照が風呂に入ってる時の水の反射にフラッシュバックを映す演出は特に良かったな。ドライおじ+59
Nadril
God I had to rewind a bit just to catch what he actually said during that lol. Was too busy being amazed at what a cool shot that was.
確かに、俺もあのシーンは何言ってるか聞き取るためにちょっと巻き戻したわ。あのカッコいいカットに夢中になりすぎてた。普通くん+5
matdragon
Yeah gotta love in the begining how misumi's face was getting blasted with snow to show case the global cooling and also as a metaphor that he has to hide his emotions for hanging his friend
Every scene in every episode so far has had so much nuance and purpose, it's kind of insane directing to be thinking about it in nearly every scene so far
確かにそうだな。冒頭でミスミの顔に雪が吹きつける描写は、地球寒冷化の表現であり、友達の前で感情を隠すメタファーとしても機能してる。全エピソードの各シーンにこういう細かい意図が込められてるのは、演出として異常なレベルだよ。ドライおじ+36
-Habb-
Another way I interpreted it is the imagery of someone spitting in your face as he continues to spout excuses. The snow was coming from the Deputy towards Aoteru. I don't think the snow was hiding his emotions because the Deputy was trying to 'justify' his BS. Once Deputy was done, Aoteru simply swept it away and continued on.
確かに。あの雪の演出、副長が言い訳を並べながらアオテルに唾を吐きかけてるみたいに見えたんだよね。雪で感情隠してるわけじゃなくて、副長が自分のクソみたいな理屈を正当化しようとしてただけだと思う。副長が言い終わった後、アオテルがそれを払いのけて進み続けたのがいい演出だった。普通くん+41
orangeoldfish
we love to see media literacy
確かに!それな!まじでメディアリテラシー大事じゃん笑ギャル+6
justsyr
>By the way, I'm a bit happy that they mentioned how the last nuclear war led to a global cooling. The environmental consequences of war is often underlooked so it's nice to see it also mentioned here.
So many little details that makes the story even greater.
So now we have 2 agricultural geniuses, it will be interesting when the 2 collide.
確かに、最終戦争が地球寒冷化を招いたという描写には私も注目していた。戦争の環境的影響が見落とされがちなテーマだからこそ、ここで触れられたのは制作陣の丁寧な世界観構築が伺える。
そして今、2人の農業の天才が存在するという状況。彼らが衝突する時、単なる技術の対立ではなく、異なる思想や価値観のぶつかり合いになるという考察ができる。この伏線がどう回収されるか、非常に楽しみだ。考察くん+18
moichispa
Some of the regions on Sei get a lot of slow nowadays. It would also explain how the region with Hokkaido has food issues (a big part of Japan industry is in Hokkaido.
I guess we will get more explanation on the following episodes probably.
せやな、セイの一部地域は今やかなり発展が遅れてるって話やろ。それなら北海道のある地域で食料問題起きてるのも説明つくわ(日本の産業の多くは北海道にあるしな)。
今後のエピソードでもっと説明あるやろな。2ちゃん+7
Nunbrot
Didn't expect that butt shot. Should definitely be the banner for this episode.
あのケツのショットは予想外だったわ。絶対このエピソードのバナーにすべきだよな。普通くん+127
Namaryu
Chanelling that Golden Kamuy energy
「ゴールデンカムイのオーラ感じるよねww このお尻アングル、まさにそれすぎるッ!」感情くん+55
AmusedDragon
Even outside of this, the show does 'feel' like Golden Kamuy in how it generally frames things and does its dialogue. It's totally different in basically every other way story-wise, of course.
確かにそれ以外の部分でも、作品の構成や会話の雰囲気がゴールデンカムイっぽい感じがするよね。ストーリー的には全然違うけど。普通くん+24
Lapiz_lasuli
The unhinged humor is similar.
確かに!そのイカれた感じの笑い方がゴールデンカムイっぽいってまじでわかるわ〜ギャル+14
NanDemoKnaives
Bulging muscles when?
それな、ゴールデンカムイのあの感じめっちゃ出てるよね。筋肉ムキムキはいつ来るんだろ。普通くん+16
cppn02
u/Abysswatcherbel you know what to do.
我が盟友よ、その臀部の一撃はまさに運命の啓示。この回の旗印として掲げるべきは明白なのだ。中二病+31
nofaxxspitintruflego
ngl would
せやな、お前なら分かってるやろ(笑)2ちゃん+13
Even-Value8075
ok that was gay as hell... aoteru u have a wife lock in
それな、めっちゃゲイすぎたわ…あおてる、奥さんいるんだからちゃんとしろよ普通くん+11
cppn02
had*
「had*」で正すとは、細かいところまで見抜く目を持つでござるな。某も同意見、あの展開はあまりにも……でござった。武士+26
Mercrist_089
NGL I can't remember the last time I saw bare butts in anime, especially this close up and boldly drawn lmao. That really took me out for a second
マジで言うけど、アニメで生尻見たの久々すぎてビビったわ!しかもこんなアップで堂々と描かれてるのやばくね?笑 一瞬フリーズしたんだけど!ギャル+17
coffeecakesupernova
How many people pinched it when it appeared? *Raises hand*
あのシーン、出てきたとき何人スクショしたんだろうな。俺もしたわ。普通くん+5
Even-Value8075
and aoteru's abs... bruh he got that twunk build down
あのシーンのお尻は予想外すぎたよな。間違いなく今週のバナーにすべきだわ。
あとあおてるの腹筋…マジで彼のツンク体型が完璧すぎるッ!感情くん+5
bushwarblerssong
原文
I hope the redditor who said they'd kill everyone and themself if anything happened to Tsune-chan is still alive after that steamy bath scene.
We have confirmation now that emperor Fuji I was a woman and the family tree in episode 2 also revealed to us that Tsune-chan's mother is the head of the Asama clan.
Although Seii includes regions with some of the most unintelligible dialects in all of Japan, their characters mainly spoke in standard Japanese and Tokyo-dialect. Muton even uses "ssu-tai (っす体)," which is more casual than the standard polite speech and combined with slang, and mainly spoken by young men. I think it emphasizes his immaturity and nonchalant attitude toward violence.
The Japanese spoken in Yamato is mainly Kansai dialect, but Aoteru uses Ehime dialect. It's partly why characters like Tsune-chan immediately clocked him as a country bumpkin. It also helps him perform as the funny-man (boke) to Tsune-chan's straight-man (tsukkomi) in their manzai act.
The characters in Seii also have very unusual names compared to the people in Yamato and you can tell that the creator was having fun when he came up with them. (Yamato's names are more orthodox and archaic.)
**Ouga**'s name (which is written with the characters for "sakura" 桜 and "tiger" 虎) and tattoo may come from the Sengoku-period daimyo, **Uesugi Kenshin**. Kenshin was born as "Nagao Kagetora" and until he took monk's vows, always used the character for tiger (tora 虎) in his names. He was also known as the "Dragon of Echigo" and in the OP, as the smoke from Ryūmon's cigar turns into a dragon rising "upstream" like the Tōryūmon proverb, the dragon then circles Ouga. (Sorry for so many edits: I just realized that the bird in the OP may also reference the Uesugi clan crest.) We also learned that Ouga's father was "Byakko)," which means "white tiger" and one of four guardians, guardian of the west, just as Bishamonten, who Kenshin worshiped and is also associated with tigers, and one of four heavenly kings, guardian of the north.
The capital of Seii is located in Niigata prefecture where Kenshin also ruled.
There is a theory that Kenshin was secretly a woman and it was the subject of the manga "Yukibana no Tora" by the author of Princess Jellyfish and Tokyo Tarareba Girls.
**Aterui** is based on the Nara-Heian period **Emishi chief of the same name**, who fought Sakanoue no Tamuramaro. (The Emishi were also indigenous to northern Japan, but should not be confused with the Ainu. Ashitaka from Princess Mononoke is Emishi.) Until modern times, he was often demonized in legends about his rival and was also known as "Akuroō," which is a name you may know from Jujutsu Kaisen. The Nippon Sangoku character's face is identical to a famous wooden sculpture of Akuroō's head carved during the Edo period. The anime character's speech is also rough as you would imagine the historical figure's speech to be.
The slogan Aterui shouted, "soni tōkan (尊夷討奸)" is a riff on "尊皇討奸 (sonnō tōkan)" or "Revere the Emperor, Destroy the Traitors" used in the 1936 coup attempt, except that "Emperor" has been replaced with the "i" in "Seii," which refers to Northern Japan and historically, specifically Emishi and Ainu cultures. As historical Arutei fought against the "Yamato" emperor in the 8-9th century, anime Arutei fights against Yamato under Fuji III. (Sonnō tōkan itself was inspired by Sonnō jōi (尊王攘夷) or "Revere the King, Expel the Barbarians"in which “夷” refers to the barbarians. I’m not sure the subtitles or dubs will convey how Aterui is subverting this slogan.)
Despite his name, **Mūton**'s name is written with the character for rabbit (兎).
The characters for **Hikabi Asahima**'s name can also be read as "Machu Pichu." "Hikabi" also sounds a bit ridiculous.
**Atara** is old Japanese for a shame/waste (as in too bad) or regrettably.
**Rinririn** is a mystery, but "rin-rin" is onomatopoeia for a phone or bell ringing. Most of the other Seii names also sound suspiciously like the creator was trolling although there could be some Ainu or Emishi influences.
温泉シーンのあと、ツネちゃんに何かあったら全員殺して自分も死ぬって言ってたRedditの人がまだ生きてるといいな。
これで富士一世が女性だったのが確定したね。第2話の家系図でツネちゃんの母親が朝摩家の当主ってのも判明したし。
征夷の方言は日本で一番わかりにくい地域なのに、キャラは標準語と東京弁がメイン。ムートンは「っす体」使ってて、若者っぽいカジュアルさと暴力への無頓着さを強調してる感じ。
ヤマトは関西弁メインだけど、アオテルは愛媛弁。だからツネちゃんに即「田舎者」ってバレたんだな。漫才のボケとツッコミの関係にもなってる。
征夷のキャラ名はヤマトより変で、作者が遊んでるのがわかる。オウガの名前(桜虎)と刺青は上杉謙信から来てるかも。謙信は「長尾景虎」名義で虎の字を使ってたし、「越後の龍」とも呼ばれてた。OPでリュウモンの葉巻の煙が龍になってオウガの周りを回るのも関連してそう。オウガの父は「白虎」で、謙信が信仰した毘沙門天も虎と関連がある。
征夷の首都は新潟県で、謙信の領地と同じ。謙信女性説もあるし、『雪花の虎』って漫画の題材にもなった。
アテルイは奈良〜平安時代の蝦夷の長と同じ名前で、坂上田村麻呂と戦った人。『ものの普通くん+119
bushwarblerssong
原文
The official anime twitter account tweeted that Denki's original name was "拓器 (possibly "Hiroki")", but he took the name "Denki (殿器)" after Fuji II bestowed the character "den (殿)" to him, which came from the emperor's own childhood name. After Denki became Lord of Home Affairs when he was 32, he poisoned Fuji II.
His new name could come from 沈殿器 (suidenki), which is the Japanese word for sediment tank. It also sounds like 便器 (benki) - toilet.
The act of a retainer receiving a character from their lord's name and using it in their own name mainly occurred from the Kamakura to the Edo period, but now we know the practice was revived at least in the nation of Yamato. Members of noble families also passed down characters from their name to their descendants, and we see this with Tsune-chan and his grandfather 仁経, who was listed in the family tree in episode 2.
仁経 (which can also be read as "Yoshitsune" and "Takatsune" though it's more likely "Toyotsune," "Hitotsune," "Masatsune," or something else) is quite similar to 仁王経, the Humane King Sutra. In that same scene with the family tree, you can also see that Tsune-chan's great aunt is 仁美子 (possibly "Hitomiko" or "Mimiko," but there are also other possibilities as Chinese characters can be read a number of ways in Japanese, especially when it comes to names).
And it is confirmed that Tsune-chan's brother is 昂経 (most likely "Takatsune") and not 昇経, so the glossary on the anime's official site did make a mistake with that.
There have been more additions to the glossary:
# Glossary
**【Proposal for Agricultural Policy Reform】**
The notebook containing Aoteru's proposals for agricultural policy reform that Aoteru gave to Ryūmon during the "Tōryūmon" recruitment exam. It states that the purpose of revising these policies is: ① to improve agricultural production in the borderlands to avoid defeat in war and ② to reinforce the standing army at the borderlands.
**【Letter of Demand for Unconditional Surrender】**
The document that Lord of Home Affairs ・Denki Taira sent to Seii, calling for their unconditional surrender.
To prevent the emergence of a capable dictator and revolution in Seii, which was suffering from severe cooling, Ryūmon Mitsuhide proposed a cease-fire agreement with the northern nation over a demand for unconditional surrender, but this proposal was rejected.
**【Fuji Clan】**
The Fuji clan descends from the imperial family that was abolished during the late-Reiwa period. The clan head is the third emperor of Yamato ・ Fuji the Third. Fuji the First was a wise monarch who brought peace to the citizens of her nation, but passed from illness after spending over 10 years on the throne.
Later, Fuji the Second was poisoned by his maternal relative, the Lord of Home Affairs ・ Denki Taira, and the third son of Fuji the Second's concubine, Fuji the Third, ascended the throne at just four years of age.
公式アニメTwitterで、デンキの元の名前は「拓器(ヒロキ?)」だったが、富士二世から「殿」の字を賜って「殿器(デンキ)」と改名したと投稿があったな。この「殿」は天皇自身の幼名に由来する。デンキが32歳で内務卿になった後、富士二世を毒殺した。
彼の新しい名前は「沈殿器(すいでんき)」から来ている可能性が考察できる。また「便器(べんき)」にも聞こえるのが興味深い。
家臣が主君の名前から一字を賜って自身の名前に用いる慣習は、主に鎌倉時代から江戸時代にかけて見られたが、これでヤマト国でも復活していたことが分かる。貴族の家系でも名前の字を子孫に継承する慣習があり、ツネちゃんとその祖父・仁経(第2話の家系図に記載)の関係にもそれが見られる。
仁経(読み方は「ヨシツネ」「タカツネ」の可能性もあるが、「トヨツネ」「ヒトツネ」「マサツネ」などがより妥当)は「仁王経(にんのうきょう)」に非常に類似している。同じ家系図の場面で、ツネちゃんの大叔母は仁美子(「ヒトミコ」「ミミコ」など様々な読み方が可能)と確認できる。
ツネちゃんの兄は「昂経(タカツネが有力)」であって「昇経」ではないことも確定したので、アニメ公式サイトの用語集は誤りだったな。
以下、用語集の追加分:
**「農政改革の建議書」**
青輝が龍門に考察くん+50
Serhiy_UA
Thank you for posting these details!
Could you tell what regions of Japan do the three nations occupy?
おおっ、詳細ありがとー!めっちゃ助かるじゃん!
でさ、三國ってそれぞれ日本のどの地域を占領してるのか教えてくれない?気になるんだけど!ギャル+14
bushwarblerssong
Thank you. There is a map in the anime's glossary. Seii is from Ishikawa to Hokkaido, Buo is from Gifu to Miyagi. Yamato is Kinki to Kyushu. I can't remember if they've discussed Okinawa yet or can see if it appeared in the ED, but I can answer your question in the source material corner with a spoiler tag if you'd still like to know.
ありがとう。アニメの用語集に地図が載ってるよ。征夷は石川から北海道、武応は岐阜から宮城。大和は近畿から九州。沖縄が話に出たかどうかは覚えてないけど、EDに映ってたか確認してみる。それでも知りたいなら、原作コーナーでネタバレありで答えられるよ。普通くん+10
171194Joy6
Hi, hello 🤣.
Had a quick seizure but I'm still kicking!
やあ、どもwww
一瞬痙攣したけどまだ生きてるぜwwwwおじ+14
bushwarblerssong
Yay! Hope you survive the rest of the season. 😉
わーい!生きててよかった!今期も乗り切ってくれよな!😉感情くん+7
Grazalia
Thanks for all the extra historical info 🙂↔️
同意。歴史の補足情報ありがたいね🙂↔️普通くん+5
bushwarblerssong
原文
Tsune-chan is male and based on Minamoto no Yoshitsune. I explained his Heian period-hairstyle in our episode 2 discussions. Since the 18th century, young Yoshitsune has always been depicted as a pretty boy beautiful enough to be mistaken for a girl.
You can use “-chan” in a nickname for boys or men if they’re a relative or close friend, or a celebrity. Sometimes it’s chosen because it rolls off the tongue better than “-kun.” For example, the famous comedian Kinichi Hagimoto is known as “Kin-chan.” “Kin-kun” would just sound odd. It doesn’t have anything to do with whether or not the person is feminine. It’s just an affectionate nickname. But you wouldn’t add it to a guy’s first full name unlike with a girl.
Tsune-chan’s mom is currently the head of the Asama clan, but before her, her father was the head according to the family tree in episode 2. I think Fuji II was depicted as male in episode 1. We don’t know what system is being used in Yamato, but it could be based on the firstborn.
ふむ…ツネちゃんは雄、源義経を基にした存在なのだ。我が第2話の語らいで既に述べた通り、彼の平安時代の髪型は18世紀以降、幼き義経は常に美少年として描かれ、少女と見紛うばかりの麗しさを持つと伝えられてきた。
男子への「ちゃん」呼びは、親族や親友、有名人に限られるもの。時には「くん」よりも語呂が良い故に選ばれる。例を挙げれば、名高き芸人・萩本欽一は「欽ちゃん」として知られ、「欽くん」は奇妙に響くのだ。これはその者の女々しさとは無関係、ただの愛称に過ぎぬ。されど女子と違い、男性の姓名に付けるのは避けるべき。
ツネちゃんの母君は現在、朝摩一族の長。だが第2話の系図によれば、その前は父君が長だったようだ。第1話ではフジ二世が雄として描かれていた。大和で何の継承制が用いられているかは不明だが、長子相続の可能性はある。中二病+9
NanDemoKnaives
原文
Lol the subtle comedy in this is amusing, like the piling of snow on Aoteru's face and the darker kind of that old guy's severed head kissing the boot of the one that killed him.
Ryuumon's claim turned out as predicted, Wajima is going to be hard to go up against if even her father was well known as a great strategist. I do like that she was able to keep casualties to a minimum, and took action to follow up on the families. It's easy to see why she was able to gather Seii together.
この微妙なコメディが面白いよね。青輝の顔に雪が積もってるとことか、あの老人の切断された首が殺した相手のブーツにキスしてるダークな感じとか。
龍門の主張は予想通りだったけど、輪島の父親が名軍師として有名だったなら、彼女と戦うのは大変そうだな。でも犠牲を最小限に抑えて、遺族のケアまでしっかりやってるのはいいと思う。だからこそ政威を集められたんだろうな。普通くん+97
Jacob-C
To me the snow piling was less about comedic effect and more about it being hard to stand face to face with a former friend that he's now about to execute.
Edit: Now that I rewatched it, it could also be the condemned guy's arguments piling on and Aoteru shaking them off as he counters with cold logic.
せやな、あの雪積もる描写はギャグっつーより、元友達で今から処刑する相手と向き合う辛さを表現してたんちゃうかな。
編集:見直したら、死刑囚の反論が積もってて、青照が冷徹な論理で振り払ってる感じにも見えるわ。2ちゃん+44
sesaman
This seems like the more likely theory to me.
確かにそれな!雪が積もる描写って、笑いより元仲間と向き合う辛さを表してる感じするよね。まじでそういう解釈のがしっくりくるわ!ギャル+13
ArtMustBeFree
It read as all of the above. It was a fantastic visual.
わかる!上のやつ全部当てはまってた。あの映像表現、めっちゃ優勝だったよねッ!感情くん+6
Alkafer
I laughed so hard at the fact that the surrenderists guards surrender while the guy was all "nah, I'm safe here". So clever. The boot kiss was the icing on the cake.
確かにそれな。降伏兵の衛兵たちは降伏してるのに、そいつだけ「俺はここなら安全だ」って顔してるのが笑える。ブーツにキスするシーンが最高だったわ。普通くん+29
Saizou1991
Golden Kamuy - esque comedy
「わかる。ゴールデンカムイっぽいギャグのノリだよな」
雪が顔に積もってる青輝のシーンとか、あのオッサンのダークな笑いとか、この絶妙なズレ加減がたまらん。好きすぎるッ!感情くん+9
PeaceAlien
Damn, the anti-surrender arc music is so groovy
いや、抗戦派の曲めっちゃノリノリだな普通くん+70
ObvsThrowaway5120
原文
I appreciate Aoteru’s dedication to upholding the law. This place needs order. He’s not being overzealous in his pursuit of justice, he’s merely upholding the laws as they were written. He’s right about a potential for a coup if he had let these things slide.
Someone like Wajima would have made a good ally for Aoteru and his goal of unifying the country. It’s a shame they’re on opposing sides. The western expedition is absolutely going to end in resounding failure. Either Taira or Ryumon’s gonna take the fall. Either way, the regime’s gonna suffer.
青天の法律遵守への姿勢は評価できる。この地には秩序が必要だ。彼は正義の執行に熱心すぎるわけではなく、単に法をそのまま執行しているに過ぎない。もしこれらの行為を見過ごしていたら、クーデターの可能性があったという彼の指摘は正しい。
輪島のような人物は、青天の国統一という目標において良い盟友になっただろう。両者が敵対しているのは残念だ。西方遠征は間違いなく大失敗に終わる。平か龍門のどちらかが責任を取らされる。どちらにせよ、政権は痛手を負うことになる。考察くん+69
IXajll
原文
> Someone like Wajima would have made a good ally for Aoteru and his goal of unifying the country. It’s a shame they’re on opposing sides.
Personally I’m hoping they both come to realize how similar their views and goals are concerning the country so they come to an understanding and become allies further down the line. Can’t imagine Aoteru/Yamato actually losing the endgame so it would be a damn shame if they end up killing Wajima in their conflict.
確かに和島は青照の国統一の目標に賛同しそうなキャラだよね。対立してるのがもったいない。個人的にはお互いの考えの近さに気づいて、将来的に協力関係になってほしいな。青照/ヤマトが最終的に負けるとは思えないし、衝突の末に和島を殺す展開は避けてほしいところ。普通くん+49
Chrono-Helix
原文
A convenient development would be something like them figuring out that Taira and maybe the emperor are horrible people, then they execute the corrupt leaders, and yay Seii and Yamato combine and then peace.
But there’s probably a lot of national pride on the line, so that’s not happening.
I could see a situation where Aoteru gets captured by Seii, and he enjoys his time with the people there. (There’s even someone who also quotes ancient Chinese philosophers!) And then Tsune comes to rescue him while killing lots of Seii people, and Aoteru feels really conflicted about the whole thing.
確かに、「便利な展開」としては平家や帝が悪者であると判明し、汚職した指導者を処刑して晴れて征夷と大和が合併、平和になる…という流れはあり得た。しかし、そこにはおそらく国家的なプライドが大きく絡んでいるから、現実的ではない。
むしろ、蒼天が征夷に捕らえられ、現地の人々と交流を楽しむ展開も考察できる。(古代中国の哲学者を引用する人物もいる!)そして常が助けに来て多くの征夷の人々を殺し、蒼天がそれに強い葛藤を覚える…というのが、より物語の構造として自然だと思われる。考察くん+21
justsyr
> figuring out that Taira and maybe the emperor are horrible people
I'd think Aoteru knows Taira is a horrible person. Perhaps Mitsuhide warns Aoteru about him after that meeting in last episode.
I would also think that when Aoteru and Wajima eventually meet they'll reach to the consensus that their goals align.
確かに。青照はもう平家がクズって気づいてると思う。この前の会話で光秀が警告したのかもね。あと、青照と輪島が最終的に会ったら、目的が一致するって結論に至るんじゃないかな。普通くん+7
boii137
the emperor's closer to a coward than an actually horrible person tbh, i can see a coup detat happening somewhere down the line, but i presume at at worst, he gets deposed and maybe gets the Puyi treatment, and at best, the guy finally grows a pair
taira defo needs to be executed tho but i do have a feeling hes the one going to pull a coup first
返信先の言う通り、平家と天皇がクソって展開は確かにありがちやな。
でも天皇はどっちかってと卑怯者って感じやろ。クーデターは起こりそうやけど、最悪でも廃位されて溥儀みたいな扱いか、マシなケースだと本気出してくれたらええな。
平家はマジで処刑すべきやけど、ワイの予想やとあいつが先にクーデター起こすやろな。2ちゃん+5
Creepy_Trip_4382
Also after what happened to Saki i dont think Aoteru has much mercy in him to pardon government officials abusing their power
確かに、サキの一件があった後じゃ、青輝が権力乱用する政府関係者を許す余裕なんてないだろうね。普通くん+6
bananeeek
I splattered my tea all over my keyboard when that rolling head kissed the boot.
It's unbelievable how much creativity goes into the smallest of details, making the most mundane scenes actually interesting.
The last time I was this captivated by what was going on the screen, was when Undead Girl Murder Farce was airing, but even that show didn't go to such lengths.
あの転がる頭がブーツにキスしたシーン、思わずお茶をキーボードにぶちまけたわ。
細部へのこだわりが尋常じゃない。ごく普通の場面すら面白くする制作陣の創造力には脱帽だ。
前回ここまで画面に釘付けになったのは『アンデッドガール・マーダーファルス』の放送時だったが、あの作品ですらここまでの域には達していなかった。考察くん+57
sesaman
Somehow I completely missed the kiss sound effect... Damn, that's on the nose.
草wwww キス音効聞き逃してたわ…確かにあれは露骨すぎるやろw2ちゃん+13
i_eat_pidgeons
I assure you dear viewer, a close-up shot of Tsune's ass is crucial to the plot
保証するよ、視聴者さん。ツネのケツのアップはプロットに不可欠なんだ普通くん+51
Nadril
"don't you think the camera angles in this anime are weird?"
「いやいや、常のケツのアップがプロットに重要ってマジかよ!w このアニメのカメラアングル、変すぎるだろッ!」感情くん+8
Even-Value8075
hey ladies, how are we feeling after the bath scene? 0\_o
おいおいお嬢ちゃんたち、風呂シーンの後どんな気分やねんwww 0_o2ちゃん+38
xyjacey
I am a feeling... Feelings lol
あのバスシーンやばくない!?まじで色々感じちゃったんだけど笑ギャル+14
Even-Value8075
aoteru is so... 0///0
同意、aoteruがまじで…//普通くん+13
caiusto
Man what a fantastic episode, I don't even have the right words for it. Presentation, music, performance, all spectacular.
まじで今回のエピソード最高すぎじゃない!?表現も音楽も演技も全部神ってるんだけど!言葉にできないくらいやばかったわ〜!ギャル+28
Sant268
尊い! the music stood out so much in this episode to me, another 10/10 episode
草ァ!今回の音楽ガチで光ってたわ、また10/10エピソードやんwww2ちゃん+30
Namaryu
For me it was the sound effects
確かに、今回は音響効果が特に良かったね普通くん+11
Atefstar123
Need need need that song at the end
最後の曲マジで欲しいンゴwww2ちゃん+30
UniqueExercise3951
same pls update if you find!!
それな!見つけたら教えてほしい普通くん+10
boii137
youll prolly have to wait for them to drop the soundtrack, afaik theres none yet
まじでそれな!サントラ待つしかないじゃん、まだ出てないっぽいし笑ギャル+8
Naked_Fool
+++++++++
あの最後の曲、絶対必要だよね普通くん+5
Jerry_MP
原文
Tsune is so hot I mean so hot I mean so hot I mean so hot I mean. The bath scene does remind me a lot of \*that\* Dungeon Meshi episode. I'm sure they're just friends fr.
The animation is just gorgeous. Loved how they used the water in that bath scene. And oh man, Ohga? You just cannot hate her. As much as I want Aoteru to succeed, I can't keep rooting for him when Ohga literally exists. Another banger episode as usual of course.
ツネマジで熱すぎンゴwww風呂シーンは確かにあのダンジョン飯の回思い出すわ。でも絶対ただの友達やろなww
作画ガチで美しいわ。風呂シーンの水の表現ヤバかった。あとオーガ?あいつはマジで憎めへんやん。青輝に成功してほしい気持ちはあるけど、オーガがいる限り応援できんわ。今週も安定の神回でした。2ちゃん+31
Even-Value8075
aoteru and tsune are yaoibait to me haha
「常(ツネ)まじイケメンすぎじゃない!?あの風呂シ scene は『あの』ダンジョン思い出すわー笑」
**返信:**
「あおてる×ツネって完全にやおい枠じゃね?てかまじそれな笑」ギャル+25
Hyouryuu-Na
I can smell the fanfics coming xD It's not quite mainstream to attract rabid fujoshis but I'll write one if nobody else does
「同人誌の匂いがプンプンするw メインストリームには届いてないから狂った腐女子は釣れないかもだけど、誰も書かないなら俺が書くよ」→ 確かに!その熱意エモすぎるw 俺も待ってるわ!感情くん+15
Even-Value8075
PLEASE DO!!!! NO ONE HAS DONE IT YET WE NEED UR SERVICE!!! ao3 doesnt even have a Nippon Sangoku tag yet....
頼む、書いてくれ!!!まだ誰もやってないし、君の力が必要なんだよ!!ao3にすら日本三國のタグがないんだよな……普通くん+8
Even-Value8075
aoteru is so hot people are sleeping on him fr
あおてるもまじでイケメンすぎだろw みんな気づいてないだけで草wwwおじ+5
thisisdropd
原文
From how Wajima had been described as a dictator by the narrator, I expected her to be quite the cutthroat bitch. Turned out she's quite the charismatic one, and also a compassionate one. How she ran a soup kitchen and personally fed the starving people. Perhaps she had a hidden dark side, but so far Seii's economy had been thriving under her rule. Little wonder the people worshipped her.
Aoteru's got competition! Wajima had a similar philosophy regarding agriculture being the backbone of the country. However, she also revelled in being a leader. She's essentially Aoteru and Yoshitsune combined. A shame they're in opposing sides, and she harboured great hatred towards Yamato. I'm looking forward to seeing them in a face-to-face meeting if there ever would be one.
Nuclear winter was especially harsh. -17 degrees in Southern Japan is mental. It's the reason the temperature was given at the start of every episode, not just this one.
Interesting that Seii was a republic while Yamato's a monarchy, which resembled today's Japan. Wonder what system Buo's using.
ナレーターが和島を「独裁者」って言うからガチのクソ女かと思ったわ。実際はカリスマあって慈悲深いやんけ。炊き出しやって自分で民に食わせてたし。裏の顔あるかもやけど、少なくとも政井の経済は彼女の統治でめっちゃ栄えてるし。民が崇拝するのも分かるわ。
青照にライバル出現や!和島も農業が国の基盤って考えは一緒やった。でもリーダーやるの楽しんでるとこもある。つまり青照と義経を足した感じやな。敵対してんのとヤマトにめっちゃ恨み持ってんのが残念。直接会う展開あれば見てみたいわ。
核の冬エグすぎやろ。南日本で-17度って正気かよ。毎回冒頭に気温表示されるの、今回だけじゃなくてそういう理由か。
政井が共和制でヤマトが君主制なの、今の日本みたいで面白いな。ブオーはどんなシステムなんやろ。2ちゃん+28
bushwarblerssong
>\-17 degrees in Southern Japan
They were in Ginzan Onsen in Northern Japan, which has some of the snowiest cities in the world. But the extra-heavy snowfall from climate change has become a big problem.
確かに、和島がナレーターから独裁者って言われてたから、もっとえげつないやつかと思ってたわ
- 南日本でマイナス17度?銀山温泉は北日本で世界有数の豪雪地帯だよ
- でも気候変動で記録的な大雪が問題になってるんだよね普通くん+15
IXajll
> I'm looking forward to seeing them in a face-to-face meeting if there ever would be one.
I really can’t imagine they will never have a face-to-face meeting, the question is rather whether we get to see it in this season or if it only happens later. Personally I’m really looking forward to it so hoping it happens sooner rather than later.
確かに、和島がナレーターから独裁者として描写されていた点を踏まえると、かなり冷酷なキャラを想像してたんだよな。
> いつか直接対決する場面が見たい
個人的には、絶対に顔を合わせる展開は来ると思う。問題は今期で描かれるか、それとも後々になるかってところだな。個人的には早めにその瞬間が見たいから、なるべく早いタイミングで来てほしいと願ってる。考察くん+13
MathRockEnjoyer420
Nah i'm riding with Seii now, commander Wajima best girl!!
いやー私もうセイイ推しになっちゃったんだけど!和島司令マジで最強の女だわ!!ギャル+28
Fuyuki027
I know this probably won’t have any romantic moments, but I’ve already sealed Aoteru x Wajima.
ワイはもうAoteru×Wajimaで確定やンゴwww
ロマンス要素はなさそうやけど、それでもワイの中ではもう完成しとるわ草2ちゃん+29
ibkthegoat
Yeah me too but we could also have aoteru x tsune
それな。でも俺はアオテル×ツネもありだと思う。普通くん+27
Even-Value8075
TSUNETERU FOR THE WIN
ツネテルしか勝たんやろwww 草2ちゃん+9
171194Joy6
Ah, I see you are a person of culture.
あー、君もわかってるね。確かにそれもアリだと思う。普通くん+8
Even-Value8075
yaoi
あらやだ、わかってるじゃーん!まじでやばくね?笑ギャル+7
ibkthegoat
Bro you don't have to tell me. Immediately I saw that juicy ass I was already building the ship
ワイも最初からそれやわ。あのええケツ見た瞬間に即座に脳内で船造り始めたンゴwww2ちゃん+5
Dark_Soul_lIl
This anime is being HEAVILY slept on, I cannot recommend it enough...
このアニメ、**めっちゃ過小評価されすぎ**だろッ!!もっと見られるべきだし、マジでオススメしすぎて困るレベル…優勝確定ッ!!感情くん+21
a1oner_bvcksn6
原文
We're headed for a collision course of epic proportions. I'm very intrigued as to how the contrast in governance--Ohga leading with compassion and respect; Denki through absolute control and fear--will clash and be presented on screen.
The parallel between Aoteru and Ohga upholding their respective principles (as shown with how they handled doling out the death penalty) was such a nice touch, with Aoteru being presented as cold and firm, while Ohga was shown to be warm and flexible.
Ohga is such a softy, I wonder what's the story on her tiger tattoo and nickname. Now that I think about it, it's most likely a homage to the "Tiger of Kai", Takeda Shingen.
Man, Tsune is such an egomaniac I honestly feel like he's my spirit animal lmao. Taking credit for a compliment meant for someone's dead wife is just next level egotism 🤣🤣
これは壮大な衝突コースに突入しているな。統治の対比——王賀が慈悲と敬意で導くのに対し、伝鬼は絶対的な支配と恐怖で統治する——が、どのように衝突し、画面上で表現されるのか非常に興味深い。
青輝と王賀がそれぞれの信念を貫く構図(死刑執行の場面で明確に描かれていた)は見事な対比だった。青輝は冷徹で硬質な印象を与え、王賀は温かく柔軟性があるように描かれている。
王賀は本当に甘いところがあるな。彼女の虎の刺青と二つ名の背景が気になる。よく考えると、これは「甲斐の虎」武田信玄へのオマージュだろうな。
つねは完全な自己愛の塊で、正直言って俺の精神的な動物だと思えてくる(笑)。亡くなった妻への賛辞を自分の手柄にするなんて、もはや次元の違うエゴイズムだわ🤣🤣考察くん+19
Chrono-Helix
原文
The pre-OP segments kind of remind me of Code Geass. I think that also had a short bit of narration before JIBUN WO began. And it’s a coincidence that Lelouch also voices a main character here.
Aoteru being such a stickler for the rules, but doing it for the sake of the people. He’s going to face some difficult decisions in the future, especially considering there are people like Taira among his superiors. This clash of idealism vs cruel reality can lead to very dramatic stories.
They’re having a lot of fun with the way they display text this episode.
Wajima… 尊い…
She’s got similar attitudes to leading people as Aoteru. But I doubt they’re going to have the chance to easily talk things out.
OP前のパートがちょっとコードギアス思い出したな。あっちもJIBUN WOが始まる前に短いナレーション入ってたし。ルルーシュが今回メインキャラの声当ててるのも偶然だよね。
青輝がルールに厳しいけど、それも民衆のためってとこがいいよね。上司に平みたいな人いるし、今後難しい決断を迫られそう。理想と現実のぶつかり合いってドラマティックな展開になりそうだ。
今週のテキスト演出、結構遊んでて面白いな。
輪島… 尊い…
彼女も青輝と同じようなリーダーシップの考え方してるけど、簡単に話し合える機会はなさそうだね。普通くん+14
ImperialDane
Phenomenal episode. Really fantastic presentation and the way it helps keep everything dynamic.. Never mind the plot and the way it advances. Snappy and brisk. Never lingering too long on anything.
神回やったわ。演出ガチでヤバかったし、動きもめっちゃ良かったンゴwww ストーリーの進め方もテンポ良くて無駄がない。さすがやわ。2ちゃん+13
Even-Value8075
well... it did linger for awhile on tsune's butt
確かに、ツネのお尻に結構長くカメラ止まってたのは気になったな普通くん+6
171194Joy6
Yes the close of Tsune-chan's cake is absolutely pertinent to the plot.
やばっ!ツネちゃんのケーキの話、まじでプロットにめっちゃ関係あるじゃん!ギャル+12
Even-Value8075
aoteru was lowk looking at it
それな!!あおてるがそのケーキガン見してたのマジでヤバいッ!絶対伏線だろこれエモすぎる感情くん+7
Namaryu
I can't wait for Aoteru to meet Ouga.
アオテルがオウガに会うのが待ちきれないな。普通くん+12
_keferter
Didn't expect Golden Kamuy shots from this anime but I'm not complaining.
まさかゴールデンカムイのオマージュが出るとは思わんかったわwww でも全然アリやろ!2ちゃん+10
bunbun777
Ok the style definitely was at an all time high, great use of music and sound effects with quick cuts, tremendous. Also....I too may have a crush on commander Wajima.
確かに今回のスタイルは最高だったな。音楽と効果音の使い方、クイックカットの編集がめっちゃ良かった。それと…俺も若狭司令にちょっとときめいてるかもしれない。普通くん+11
Beastout5225
Does anyone know what the song is for the last minute of the episode during the speech?
あの最後のスピーチのとこで流れてた曲、誰か知ってる人いる?マジで気になるんだけど!ギャル+10
AdellheidV
I want to know it too. Such a good ost. Please tell me if you're find it.
それな!ワイも知りてえわ。めっちゃ良いOSTやん。見つけたら教えてクレメンス2ちゃん+5
Superb-Ad5771
This show is soooo good!
このアニメめっちゃいいね!普通くん+8
Nachtwandler_FS
It is still interesting how they switch between dark humor and actual serious staff.
Will be interesting ro see how Ougs and Aoteru collision will end. I do hope both will survive, the real enemy here is Denki after all.
せやな、ダークユーモアとガチなシリアスを切り替えるの上手いよな
オウガスとアオテルの衝突がどうなるか楽しみやわ。ワイは両方生き残ってほしいンゴ。だって真の敵はデンキやしなwww2ちゃん+7
actuallyrndthoughts
Tattoo girl was a lot kinder than expected, such a dictator
タトゥーの女、思ったよりずっと優しかったな。あんな独裁者なのにね。普通くん+9
Hyouryuu-Na
Tsune and Aoteru so cute together awww! I can't with Tsune's narcissism lmao. Aoteru thinking bout Saki when it comes to someone brave and Tsune thinking he's the one xD I'm glad Wajima isn't an evil bitch. Her heart's in the right place, for the people. Setting the story in winter was a great decision. The snow is beautiful
ツネとアオテルのやり取りが可愛すぎる……!ツネのナルシシズムには笑うしかないな。アオテルが“勇敢な人”と言われてサキを思い浮かべたのに対し、ツネが自分だと思い込んでる構図、まさにキャラの対比が効いてる。和島が悪役じゃなくて良かった。彼女の行動原理は民衆のためで、心は正しい方向を向いている。冬を舞台にしたのは英断だな。雪景色の美しさが物語のトーンを引き締めている。考察くん+8
Shimmering-Sky
原文
- So this guy was a thief responsible for killing some civilians (and also one got raped? ). That makes sense to get the death penalty.
- How can Aoteru just stand there while the snow builds up on his face?
- Bribery won’t work here.
- This episode certainly likes to have things splattering on the “camera”. Cool bit of directing.
- Yes, the camera had to hold on Tsune’s bare ass for several seconds. It’s necessary for the plot.
- Oh boy…
- Well *damn*, that’s one way to make someone commit seppuku.
- Ohga and Aoteru going head-to-head in the future should be *hella* fun, I hope.
- She’s clearly the type to feel a personal responsibility for things. It also doubles as good publicity.
- Same as Aoteru already did, huh.
この男、民間人殺した上にレイプもしてたんだな。死刑も当然だよな。
青輝の顔に雪積もってるのに平気で立ってられるのすごくない?
ここで賄賂は通用しないね。
今回の話、カメラに何かが飛び散る演出が多かったな。面白い監督の意図だと思う。
確かに常の裸のケツを数秒映し続けるのは、プロットに必要だったんだよな…。
あらら…
おいマジかよ、切腹させる方法としてそれはアリだな。
大我と青輝の将来の対決、めっちゃ楽しみだわ。
彼女は明らかに何でも自分の責任に感じるタイプだね。それでいい宣伝にもなるし。
青輝が既にやったことと同じか。普通くん+6
Fuuujinnn
What's the song that was playing during Wajima's closing speech?
ワジマの最後のスピーチのときに流れてた曲、めっちゃ気になるんだけど!誰か知ってる人いる?教えてほしい〜!ギャル+7
drt0
I was thinking that Aoteru and Ouga will be the power couple to unite Japan again, but then Ouga declared Yamato their existential enemy, so the prospects of a political marriage seem more unlikely lol.
アオテルとオウガが日本を再統一するパワーカップルになるのかなと思ってたけど、オウガがヤマトを生存の敵って宣言しちゃったから、政治的な結婚の可能性はますます遠のいたねw普通くん+6
Creepy_Trip_4382
If he defects i hope he drags Tsune-chan with him, that's Japan ass
もし裏切るならツネちゃんも道連れにしてくれや、それが日本のケツやろwww2ちゃん+6
Jacob-C
原文
Considering how they hyped up Aoteru as the man who is going to become the greatest military genius of their time, and his strict adherence to military law, I can't see things ending well for Ouga and her regime. The cold weather of the north is probably Seii's greatest defense, going on the offensive seems like a move they'll regret.
Ouga riled up her people with hatred for Yamato, so her soldiers will most likely be ruthless during the initial invasion. This will then fan the flames on the other side, meaning that they'll probably face an even more cruel counter.
Yet another amazing episode!
アオテルが「当代随一の軍事的天才になる男」と大々的に持ち上げられていたこと、そして彼の軍律に対する徹底した姿勢を考えると、オウガとその政権にとって良い結末は迎えられないという考察ができる。北方の寒さこそがセイイ最大の防御線であり、彼らが攻勢に出るのは後悔する選択になると思われる。
オウガは民衆をヤマトへの憎悪で扇動したため、初期の侵攻では自軍の兵士が容赦ない行動に出るだろう。その結果、相手側の怒りに油を注ぎ、さらに残酷な報復を招くという負の連鎖が予想される。
それにしても、今回も実に素晴らしいエピソードだった!考察くん+6
OddTea74
THIS SHOW IS SO GOOD. IT DESERVES TO BE TOP 10 THIS SEASON
このアニメガチで良すぎやろwww
今期トップ10に入って当然やんけ!2ちゃん+5
rossocenere
This show is on another level. I am seriously blown away.
このアニメ、次元が違いすぎるッ!マジで衝撃やばい。感情くん+5